Cthulhu War Tempest

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:57 pm

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Black Goat wins with exactly 30. Note that CC could gamble and ritual here, using the vast majority of its power to go to either 29, 30, or 31, but the bot doesn't do that because it doesn't know that Black Goat has 30.

It should have ritualed -- the elder sign would have been a 3. I'm not changing that algorithm, though.
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:58 pm

Opener never Ascended, because the power was always off. I need a paradigm for that
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:41 pm

Doug wrote: Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:57 pm Image

Black Goat wins with exactly 30. Note that CC could gamble and ritual here, using the vast majority of its power to go to either 29, 30, or 31, but the bot doesn't do that because it doesn't know that Black Goat has 30.

It should have ritualed -- the elder sign would have been a 3. I'm not changing that algorithm, though.
i feel like you ritual there almost always; you will usually still have at least one gate so you can win next round either way. Not ritualing to stop someone else who doesn't win now but would win with more than thirty next turn is a pretty narrow thing to play around.

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:43 pm

and various things like harbinger will let you win before next turn

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:20 pm

Maybe

Then, what's the algorithm? Ritual no matter the cost if it would take you to 30+ (of course), but also ritual if it would take you to 29+ if you're a faction that can earn elder signs during the action round?
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:23 pm

i would probably always ritual to 29, rolling a 1 just means you win next turn anyway

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:37 pm

What about 28?
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:53 pm

See now if you say that the bot will do an expensive ritual as long as this would take the bot to 28, then you're pretty much saying that the bot will ritual if the ritual can take it to 30
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:00 pm

28 probably but less certain

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:02 pm

it's a bit harder to get 1 gate and ritual power but still not that difficult

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:11 pm

I don't understand, "one gate and ritual power"?
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sat Jul 27, 2019 9:58 pm

if you still have one gate on the next turn you can ritual to win then, so usually taking a shot to draw a three won't slow you down much if you miss

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:11 am

Alright, so I've had all day to think about it, and I think this is where we run into the difference between the bot being good at beating you, and the bot being a good bot

It's true that it might actually be the best strategy for the bot to spend 9 power from 14 to ritual when only a 3 elder sign will get to 30. But let's say the bot is playing with humans, and the humans lose because the bot does this and gets that 3 elder sign

I don't think that's fun
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Rylinks » Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:12 am

that is a very reasonable position!

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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:40 am

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Sleeper shows off the power of the Gate Farm strat. Opener shows off the power of being Opener
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Jul 28, 2019 7:39 pm

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Alright, so I had a round three where Sleeper tapped out to get a spellbook, and Opener annihilated Sleeper, going to 26 doom, and knocking Sleeper down to 1 gate. And it was totally devastating.

So based on that, I decided Sleeper absolutely needed a vector where if buying a spellbook would give opponents power, it prefers to wait until those opponents are out of power. And then I rewound round three and did round three again. Well, this changed everything, of course. Sleeper Lethargied even more aggressively, and then when Opener tried to yoink a Sleeper gate, Sleeper had the power to put another snake man onto it. The round ended up very different.

Now it looks like Opener needs to prioritize taking Dragon Ascending even higher, probably
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Jul 28, 2019 11:21 pm

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Opener uses Dragon Ascending to ritual, but probably should have taken it and used it earlier than this
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:11 am

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I made some tweaks and started this game over. I tweaked Opener so that he looks harder for a chance to Ascend, and I made everyone a little less reactive to Beyond One.

Opener's second round was nuts here, because he got out Yog and then Ascended off of Sleeper, giving him a double round
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:58 am

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All three seem solid here
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:15 am

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Nyarlathotep goes down to Antarctica and captures both players' cultists there. Sleeper waits, and then goes nuts when everyone else is out of power, capturing four blue units.
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Sep 01, 2019 5:54 pm

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Opener wins in the doom phase.

Yog got knocked around, but survived, which obviously is important
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:04 pm

Let's consider CC not bringing out Nyarlathotep until round three. CC can go for four gates round two while everyone else is tapping out
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:42 pm

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The end of round two

CC didn't get to four gates, due to the cost of guarding them and the bot paradigms therein -- might have to make a special case
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:07 am

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Pretty normal stuff here
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Juri » Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:22 am

Doug wrote: Mon Sep 02, 2019 4:07 amPretty normal stuff here
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Tue Sep 03, 2019 3:53 am

Doodut doodut doontuna doodut
Doodut doodut doontuna doodut
I'm just a GOO
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:57 pm

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CC rolls a 6 for Thousand Forms, but both Sleeper and Windwalker pay 3. Windwalker Hibernates at 3 power, going to 5. Sleeper needs to pay 3 and give someone 3 power -- he gives it to Windwalker, who goes to 8. Windwalker then has 20 power during the doom phase. That may have been a huge mistake.

CC is winning, but has paid a premium for it. If no one can get to 6 spellbooks, will CC force everyone to lose?
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:41 am

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Poor Windwalker, ganked by both opponents, even losing a gate to Sleeper almost immediately after building it.

CC wins

The Hatred Module was too low in the flowchart to come into play
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Juri » Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:56 am

I'm always rooting for the hatred module to come into play
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Re: Cthulhu War Tempest

Post by Doug » Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:38 pm

Yeah

WW building a gate in Round Five when there are enemy gates for the taking is just incorrect
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